Citizens Prerogative Podcast Closed Caption Transcript
CPP S3 E59 Forced Pregnancy

09:38:26 In times like these. Being a citizen is a big job.
09:38:28 Thank you for joining us to celebrate the virtues of self-rule and debate the state of our Republic.
09:38:34 Welcome to the citizens prerogative. podcast This is the voice of your nerdy host, Michael Piscatelli, and we are inspired by a co-host whose passion for our republic proceeds him everywhere.
09:38:44 He goes. Raymond Wong, Jr. Thank you.
09:38:47 Thank you, and it it just much must mention the royal family in light of their financing.
09:38:53 Of all of the history. and this episode, this is episode. Number 59.
09:39:02 We are still in season 3, and the title of this episode is going to be forced.
09:39:09 Pregnancy again. so as the title goes in general, with these episodes, you can get a sense of where we're going.
09:39:23 Although you don't hear right now, forced pregnancy as a term that's getting thrown around as much as abortion.
09:39:32 But really that's what we're talking about do we force pregnancy, or don't we force pregnancy, and who gets to choose?
09:39:43 Let's go ahead and open this up with a paraphrase from Gandhi and from Jefferson, and I mean Thomas Jefferson.
09:39:50 One of the founders. If we measured society based on how we are treating our most vulnerable, it would get a failing grade.
09:40:02 My far forced pregnancy and childbirth have a long and disgusting history in our country.
09:40:13 In the United States as well as in the world. The Un.
09:40:18 Recognizes this as a human rights violation and tracks this as a global problem.
09:40:24 I'm talking about forced childbirth and it and if you weren't tracking me that is what happens when you don't allow people access to abortion the slavery economy in the United States featured this function at
09:40:41 its core a potentially renewable resource for labor at cost, or an asset to be sold.
09:40:52 Plantation owners would routinely force pregnancy on their slaves and their wives.
09:41:00 From the sake of the business. You need errors to take over your business.
09:41:03 You need slaves. Stop right in the fields. You have semen in your loins, and you can populate your plantation
09:41:17 From that perspective it's. pretty easy to see how it was a patriarchy that we've stumbled into, or have had imposed upon all of us.
09:41:30 We must also mention that sexual violence is a part and parcel for much of this, including the opposite.
09:41:40 I'm talking about force pregnancy, but the opposite of force pregnancy is for sterilization.
09:41:48 So that was another factor. They had no interest in you breeding, or possibly you didn't listen well enough, and as a punishment.
09:42:00 You will never have another child again, Essentially, no, byly autonomy.
09:42:06 And we have a longer history of no body bodily autonomy in this country than we do freedom for women and people in general.
09:42:18 That was a powerful set of statements, and really washed over me.
09:42:23 And I was I was thinking, you know these it's it's very.
09:42:27 It's a travesty what was happening during these times.
09:42:31 But we have to also shed light on on the north, I think, a little bit.
09:42:35 So they were doing the reverse. Right they were. they were they were not you leveraging slavery for their economy, but they needed to be competitive. so they put their children into the factories.
09:42:47 Understand that right? So the youth and you know you put your entirely entire family to work essentially so.
09:42:54 So if you had able-bodied children you know the North was, I think, there's still a similar situation going on for the poor working white right?
09:43:03 So the barons were controlling one population segment in the South. and then in the North you have the poor working white, or the other minorities that made it into the cities and such.
09:43:18 Oh, totally 100% that's excellent point and then especially on the immigration front, because when the Irish and the Italians and other people came, they weren't white when they came off the boat they were fodder for
09:43:31 the factories, just like a slave would be in the South on the plantation.
09:43:37 I suppose, with a little more freedom, but not much money to execute on that.
09:43:47 Freedom.
09:43:49 Oh, feels like feels like a whole system of the halves versus the have nots.
09:43:53 As if the the Constitution, the United States, was created and put into place by a bunch of wealthy people
09:44:01 They would have you call them enlightened please Oh, isn't that the truth enlightened in all the ways, except for the ones that they didn't want to look so some of the preceding points we've made and others
09:44:20 you know, are our actually clearly articulated in an Amicus brief from Howard University School of Law.
09:44:28 For the recent Dobb's case that went before Scotus.
09:44:33 So the bob's case I Imagine most people right now but if you're listening to this year, or 2 from now hopefully, maybe you don't know what the dobs case is that'd be great and everything's back to normal
09:44:42 but the Doms case is the one that just went through, and and Supreme Court used that to send abortion back to all the States.
09:44:50 So States get to legislate abortion and force pregnancy as I'm. going to be referring to it now from for the future.
09:44:59 And what's interesting is this amicus brief if you're not familiar with amicus brief anybody use a friend of the court law schools, nonprofits, companies, lobbyists, Whoever anybody who has an interest in a
09:45:13 particular case, and wants to express some opinions, legal or otherwise, share some experience, help the court understand, have available multiple perspectives around the case.
09:45:27 Groups outside the court can submit anarchus brief it's up to the court to review.
09:45:31 They can decide what to do or not do it's just informative. it's just giving the court more information to help inform its decision, because justices are not experts in everything.
09:45:43 They cannot be. and so the experts come, and they supply Amicus.
09:45:47 This. This was one amicus brief from Howard University, and when I was talking about the history of the slavery and pregnancy, I I borrowed heavily from there.
09:45:58 Amitus. So, for instance, I have a piece I pulled out here because slaves were property.
09:46:07 After Congress prohibited the importation of slaves in 1,808 slave masters, who could no longer rely on the international slave trade to replenish their labor force, gained an acute economic incentive
09:46:21 to govern black women's, reproductive lives, female slaves were valuable to their masters, not only for their labor labor, but also for their ability to produce more slaves, and that I pulled as a quote from the Amicus
09:46:37 brief.
09:46:41 As far as revisiting forced labor. There is another perspective that came to us from Northwestern University school of law, and it provided another legal perspective for consideration on this situation.
09:46:59 So we highly recommend you take a look at that but basically it's talking about force, labor, and revisiting it as a component of the thirteenth amendment and and looking at it through a faculty working paper related to
09:47:14 abortion. One of the things that they found in looking at that
09:47:22 Is that if you force anyone into pressures, that is 9 months of servitude.
09:47:31 So going back to the Thirteenth Amendment, and abortion is in the Thirteenth Amendment.
09:47:38 It says: People are no longer allowed to be put under the conditions of servitude.
09:47:45 And the argument that this faculty working paper case makes and i've seen it echoed in other places is that if you force a woman to be pregnant, then she's in servitude for 9 months at least and that's
09:47:55 assuming she survives the ordeal and so it's a forcing a woman to remain pregnant as a violation of the Thirteenth Amendment under that perspective.
09:48:12 That's it's deep it's deep it's difficult for me to think about.
09:48:17 You know your forcing me to reckon with the idea that you know we're all part of the same struggle When we see people on the street corner.
09:48:26 We can't look at them as Someone who's separate we need to look at them as us.
09:48:31 We need to say that that's the range of my available prosperity in the United States within the world.
09:48:38 The definitely But let's let's be more realistic.
09:48:43 This is what makes me feel like I have to stop thinking because if you think about an economy with slavery that just brought down the base for everyone, right? If you have a free labor, renewable labor it's like robotics, right it's almost
09:48:54 like we're re-examining a reverse side of this whole situation.
09:49:00 You know that's coming so with the with it with the labor and automation coming.
09:49:06 You have free labor coming back hopefully in an ethical way.
09:49:08 But you in a turn in addition it's very difficult to say, especially with all the news going around.
09:49:15 But I think that's what's challenging is for me is we cannot again look at yourself as I think we are really good as citizens looking at the wealthy and being oh, yeah, that's within my range.
09:49:26 But if you think your due wealth you need to look at the poor and say, well, that means i'm equally as do, and it's as probable that I will be there
09:49:39 That's exactly right. The worst case scenario is available for all of us, except for the most wealthy among us, and that's by their design.
09:49:50 Okay, not by their greatness we won't go into that now, but our tax system advances the rich over all of us.
09:50:01 So it's not because they're great people or smart or amazing.
09:50:07 It's just because rich alright, so I keep breathing deeply into the microphone.
09:50:15 This is it's a deep topic for me citizen do good might pull their sponsorship if we failed to mention that, according to the literal text of the fourteenth amendment to the constitution citizens are
09:50:28 born or naturalized, and will never be deprived of life, liberty, or property.
09:50:35 The unborn are clearly not citizens and not entitled to rights.
09:50:41 But when you talk about not being deprived of life, liberty, or property, 9 months of pregnancy is definitely an affront to that
09:50:55 So, in spite of all the perspective of history that was reestablished for the record in painful detail.
09:51:03 During this conversation, that we're having now and the fact that the Constitution does not grant rights or privileges to the unborn Dobs.
09:51:14 This case that threw everything up into the air became the case.
09:51:19 Our religious court used to put reproductive rights back on the legislative block for all 50 States.
09:51:26 So much for liberty. and Now we get to spend so much time and energy distracted by fighting this thing that was so already long hard at, fought for, and had been one. We're gonna be distracted from some of the other
09:51:41 major things that need to be addressed that are new problems, not this old patriarchal idea
09:51:54 With that it's time for our break
09:52:06 I forgot to review which one I did before something I know where to pick up.
09:52:16 I'm just gonna go with B
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09:53:54 When I think about the pass and and what's brought us to this point. losing these rights right? seeing our fellow citizens women losing these rights, it's it's it's tough for me to imagine but Yeah, i've
09:54:13 heard some interesting things about how we gone here as a nation right it's it.
09:54:21 It Wasn't done by legislative appointment usually it was a bold move of the pen stroke of the pen.
09:54:27 Even Lincoln, when he emancipated the slaves, as I understand, to kick that effort off.
09:54:33 It was just an executive action he didn't even have all the support he just did.
09:54:40 An executive action, as I understood, which, kicked off that movement towards Set pushing ourselves away from slavery as a nation, saying we would free them.
09:54:48 Once we ended the war. and this is what led to a huge swell of people joining the army right that they had a huge conscription of of black men who joined to fight, and join the military with the Union so I I
09:55:05 believe that we cannot look back and say, Oh, it must be done through legislative!
09:55:11 Oh, it must be written into Oh, there there are great moments in history, and the court jumped on that. it's it's almost like they must have been part of the civics classes that didn't have history as part of them right It was all
09:55:26 philosophical future and how we're a great nation and how we're setting the tone for the rest of the world, and not the important past that happened.
09:55:37 There are reasons why people made bold steps, bold moves.
09:55:42 Are we going to argue that slavery should go because Lincoln kicked it off wrong as a matter of documentation?
09:55:50 Should we give back the Louisiana purchase to France because because Jefferson didn't go through Congress?
09:55:59 What is the where do we stop government, or specifically the courts?
09:56:05 Right now. totally yeah, I mean. and I imagine this is the component of checks and balances.
09:56:17 Or at least the hope of the vision of checks and balances to say, Okay, those things getting out of listing.
09:56:23 It's getting out of line so starting to cause some tension everywhere else.
09:56:28 Hopefully. we can restore that balance trying times I won't talk about political parties, and and their part in all of this, too, because you mentioned civics, and I was thinking to myself, you know who benefits by not having civics, in
09:56:44 schools, the people who get a competitive advantage owning the corner on civics.
09:56:48 Both the parties. They must have agreed to take civics out of the schools so that they could own civics.
09:56:56 Okay, I digress, let's move into call to action we're actually doing pretty good on time.
09:57:05 One of the things that this podcast and Ray and I, and and anybody who joins us over time, we will always try and challenge others to do is learn more about the United States, learn more about our history, especially the uglier parts.
09:57:23 The uglier parts are the most formative parts.
09:57:29 Our country. The biggest reasons we've ever done anything are from the ugliest things that have ever happened.
09:57:37 It's a very reactionary system we're not so good at planning, and you know, plotting making the better future.
09:57:46 We're better at reacting to a bad future now to make the next one better.
09:57:50 So that is why it's so important for us to look at history, and see the capacity for this system to do bad to do wrong in the sense that it's things that are not collaborative.
09:58:09 They're not helpful to us as a community in a species The parts that act as warnings through history.
09:58:16 If we only learn them these very ugly things. Anything, again, is a bad slogan.
09:58:25 When we learned all of the atrocities of history if you're trying to do something in America again. chances are it's pretty ugly that's that's beautiful and I has so it's poetic almost
09:58:41 there's so many meetings behind that one it's the uglier part is the most interesting part, and you have to be very aggressive here in the United States.
09:58:52 Because there have been people that have died off. but they did a really good job at setting up our museums and our historical societies, and our mission statements, and all of the foundations of the United States Museum system have their
09:59:10 roots tied in a little bit of this whitewashed i'll call it i'm not going to use the power words that are out right now.
09:59:17 It has been whitewashed, and it's because we wanted to tell the good story right?
09:59:21 We didn't want to talk about the depression that some of these historic homes have gone through.
09:59:26 They didn't want to talk about it being a red line neighborhood.
09:59:30 They just wanted to restore it to its historic past and love it.
09:59:33 And that story is probably repeated throughout the country. And so we should.
09:59:38 You have to actually pull back the veil of the museum.
09:59:42 And when that curator says, Do you have any questions, say yes, tell me more.
09:59:49 Ask the questions about the history They don't talk about what happened to this house after or during the depressions that you know happened.
09:59:59 Try to pull pill back the onion and it it is sweet.
10:00:03 Some onions are sweet. Yeah, i'll argue that knowledge is always sweet, even if it's a bitter fruit
10:00:18 Is a great call out especially around the museums, because the museums have been curated through bias.
10:00:25 All of them. So what bias is it you know maybe that's what you go in like thinking ahead of time.
10:00:31 Let me do my best to sense. Is there bias? Is there something missing?
10:00:34 Is there something hidden, or are they tamp, testing or avoiding? something like that?
10:00:39 Should actually be the challenge for all of us every time we go into museum is okay.
10:00:43 I am here as a bias detective. Oh, my good, that might be a document that comes out.
10:00:49 But that might be a good question, anyways, like, what is your museum doing to work on its cultural bias?
10:00:56 And if the curator runs out of the room you know we're onto something, if they don't want to talk about bias. Oh, that tells you everything you need to know and you'll have to talk to someone else to get the
10:01:08 story So start start with that start with a group or a museum, or a set of events.
10:01:16 Even that are relevant to today. to you in your life or the news that you see keep coming up, and it's something you don't know about, because you can watch the news.
10:01:29 They're never going to tell you history. of anything they're just gonna throw it out there like an outrage or this or that, And it's like, okay, But why why it's so important to Ask that.
10:01:39 Question, you know, where, where does where does the basis for all of this come from?
10:01:45 Because we're only seeing the tips of icebergs when we're scanning the fractured and dysfunctional media ecosystem.
10:01:57 We have today. Be curious. Follow the money right. Follow the money.
10:01:59 Something you hear a lot of. and and just remember that clicks matter.
10:02:03 And you see these, and I, I frankly stay away from what I tend to see sensational documents or sensational articles.
10:02:10 I will review them as a matter of just checking it.
10:02:13 And if it is what I thought, if it was clicked bait, I will block the organization, or whatever page.
10:02:19 It is because I I have to look at Facebook and things like that that you have to maintenance it.
10:02:22 You have to block those individuals who are sharing that kind sensationalism which includes a lot of news organizations too totally.
10:02:34 This keyword click, bait, headline culture is all about invoking.
10:02:44 Whatever your emotional addiction is sadness anger excitement puppies cuteeness, it doesn't matter if you're if you give yourself to any of those emotions on a regular basis, and you follow the click bait
10:02:54 it's gonna take you where you're going and that's unhealthy.
10:02:59 It's actually unhealthy for us to be doing that need to be aware of it.
10:03:04 But like you're saying ready you know you gotta you gotta click through it, and you see what it is.
10:03:07 And now you've learned now you know don't go down there anymore, or the next time you do see something from them, you understand from what perspective they're there bringing it up, it's probably not to inform you
10:03:27 So I think this is just a reiteration of what we've been talking about.
10:03:30 I I mentioned here to keep an eye out for headlines.
10:03:34 Keep an eye out in headlines for clues in your search.
10:03:38 Because most stories today lack that historical context so I think we've delayed that now, and our last call to action here is going to be a familiar one at the tail end of this year, though please, we have at the time this
10:03:56 episode is dropping, we should still have an election coming up in November, 22 support the candidates that support civil rights for us all.
10:04:09 I I I agree I couldn't agree more voting is important.
10:04:16 If you imagine what happened in this last major election cycle and if you're watching years from now, you know hopefully, we can look back in the history books and say, Wow, what an interesting time!
10:04:26 But voting does matter. Every vote counts and by the way if anyone in your family says voting doesn't matter.
10:04:32 I don't know where that propaganda came from, but you can send them to us.
10:04:37 Tell them that there's a voice here that's willing to guide them and and tell them how their voice does matter, because we believe that every citizen is contributing to a greater society.
10:04:50 The wealthy Believe it. they cash that check every day of their lives here.
10:04:57 Here.
10:05:01 We have been your host. Thank you, Mr. Raymond, Long, Jr.
10:05:06 And thank you, Mr. piscatelli this has truly been historical briefing.
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